ignition adjustment

[zamiex]

hi guys,
since i just install igniton harness, just curious in to know how/when to adjust
the map?

when do i need to advance/retard in the ignition map? some say its kinda dangerous to play with the ignition.. need some advice here thanks

[Dzaster]

That is where the dyno is handy as you can watch what your timing is doing as you shoot it with the timing light.

The other thing is if you hear detonation/pinging then you need to bring back timing.

I read somewhere online that to be safe you can retard timing 1 degree per pound of boost. That is just what I read though.

[zamiex]

how do the detonation/pinging sounds like?

well im kinda confuse to know when to retard or advance the timing?
can u explain more in retarding 1 degree per pound of boost? how do i do that?

[Dzaster]

Below is a sample ignition map, it's not mine, I was given that by a friend just for referencing. But basically you have the Greddy MAP sensor Voltage on the left as a guide. 1.50v is 0 boost/vacuum, to just pulled timing as the boost increased.
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc340/dzaster96799/Tuning/Igtiming.png

Check this chart, got it from a thread here in DIYTuning. It's helpful for crossreferencing the voltage to psi.
http://i525.photobucket.com/albums/cc340/dzaster96799/Tuning/Conversion.png

As for detonation it sounds almost like a diesel motors clicking/tapping but more high pitch. Maybe like some loose bolts ina tin can--so I seen someone describe it once.:p But that is what it sounds like.

[zamiex]

wow.. thanks a lot..

ok, so if im not using greedy MAP sensor, can i use my stock MAF as reference?
so, how would that be?

Q: for my car, already its already equip with knock sensor, so the timing will be auto adjust(retard/advance) if it detects knocking right?
so, do i really need to adjust the ignition timing?

[Dzaster]

For the knock, I'm not certain but I know guys with factory knock sensors that still need to pull timing. Prolly because the facgtory ECU is only capable of pulling so much at given RPM/TPS range.

Is the stock MAF boost compliant? I'm not sure what car you have and if it comes from the factory turbo charged, if it does then there should be some way of referencing your MAF's voltage and converting it to vaccum/boost psi. I'll be honest with you I don't know about MAF personally.

A greddy or GM modded MAP sensor would be best for your tuning off of boost. I do recommend.;)

[maxgtr2000]

I've used the maf voltage for retarding timing, what you do is see what your maf voltage is at the pressure you want to start retarding. Do a quick run to say 6 psi with the map trace feature on the ignition map with maf voltage as the scale, you will see where the voltage lines up at and you can do the map from there. Every car brand is different and turbos are different psi wise. On vq30 maximas we pull timing around 6 psi 1 degree up until 5000rpm ( we are at 5 degrees now)then we add back a degree before redline since we start redlining at 6500. You want to pull timing earlier than 6psi in your case to be safe since you are new to this. This week I changed my timing to respond to the pressure sensor, the car pulls a little harder. So maf voltage ignition timing is ok if you don't have a greddy pressure sensor, but I would definitely get the pressure sensor, it's worth the investment or do the gm sensor which would be fairly cheaper.

[Dzaster]

I've used the maf voltage for retarding timing, what you do is see what your maf voltage is at the pressure you want to start retarding. Do a quick run to say 6 psi with the map trace feature on the ignition map with maf voltage as the scale, you will see where the voltage lines up at and you can do the map from there. Every car brand is different and turbos are different psi wise. On vq30 maximas we pull timing around 6 psi 1 degree up until 5000rpm ( we are at 5 degrees now)then we add back a degree before redline since we start redlining at 6500. You want to pull timing earlier than 6psi in your case to be safe since you are new to this. This week I changed my timing to respond to the pressure sensor, the car pulls a little harder. So maf voltage ignition timing is ok if you don't have a greddy pressure sensor, but I would definitely get the pressure sensor, it's worth the investment or do the gm sensor which would be fairly cheaper.
Great reply right here. I just wasn't sure about tuning of gteh MAF only, but apparently is possible. Nice!

[zamiex]

yes yes.. great reply...

just to get things right, this means that when im in boost lets say TPS 70-100%, i need to retard my ignition timing right? for the low vacuum i need to start advancing right?

do u have more example on the ignition map? thank a lot :D

[Dzaster]

I don't know about your motor but on my motor I can advance some while in vacuum still and then yes, once boost starts you can begin pulling timing to be safe.

[zamiex]

my engine looks like this...

come from stock mitsu lancer 4G93T, upgraded from td0413G to td0516G, injector 450cc.

http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb164/syenaz/EngineBay.jpg

do i really need to adjust my timing since this car is equip with knock sensor?

[Dzaster]

Prolly not if low boost. If higher than norm for those cars then yes as they ECU's are most likely mapped from the factory to only counter so much. A littler higher would prolly be manageable by the ECU alone but gobbs more would need your manual attention.:D

[zamiex]

what happen if i detect knock while in boost?
should i retard or advance the timing?

[Dzaster]

You'll want to retard timing.

[Accord2nrz]

safe ratio is retard 1 degree for every 2 lbs of boost i think